New Mige BISS-C Encoder


#102

Thanks Brion.
I will have him try these.
The last number is the inertia, isn’t that responsible for the heaviness of the wheel?
So lower number, less heavy? Or is that back to front?

He is going to try 0.5, 0.5 and 1.0 respectively.

I can’t recall just how bumpy my 10K encoder was, so now I am curious what it feels like after having used the 2048 line 2.1M SinCOS for close to 2 years.

It must be like a dumpster truck!


#103

No friction controls the static heaviness.

Inertia controls bot return rate speed and at the same time makes counter force movements by you more resistive. So basically if you are turning in the direction of the force it makes it easier and if you are turning opposite the direction of the force it makes it harder as inertia tries to get the servo moving faster in the direction it is told applying more current.

Damping adds a braking force as the rotation slows regardless of direction.


#104

So the higher the inertia number, the more resistance?


#105

The more resistance when the wheel wants to go the other direction but less resistance when you turn with the direction the wheel wants to go.

So an example would be that when going into the corner the wheel will weight up more but once you start coming off it will generally lighten up when using inertia.


#106

Thanks Brion!
Very nice to understand this.

What would you suggest for small MiGe on 2048 line SinCOS?
Currently I’m using 1.0, 1.0 and 3.33 (inertia)


#107

my settings when I had a Small Mige in my possession were as follows:

Small Mige w/ SinCOS encoder - 12.86A MMC

Overall Strength = 100%
Reconstruction Filter = 5
TBW = unlimited
Notch = off
Dampening = 2.25%
Friction = .75%
Inertia = 0.0%

iRacing Strength Slider = 33Nm

This is a quite High Specific output at .6:1 so the strength at the wheel might be higher than you like it is just raise the iRacing slider Nm to what you like… The Settings also produce a more subdued feel to the wheel but given your current settings yours could be more subdued depending on the Recon filter being used.

I haven’t actually run with a Small Mige for quite a while but nothing in the SimuCUBE system has changed regarding the FFB since I used these settings and I haven’t really altered any of my driving settings for quite a while.


#108

There is no generic ‘correct’ setting.

We are all different, ffb feel/filtering is very subjective. Just have a play and settle on something you like.

On my big akm65k servo, I have Damping =5, Friction and Inertia both 1.5

This gives a pretty heavy and filtered ffb, which I far prefer over the noisy unfiltered ffb some like…like said, it’s very subjective, what I or the next guy like, may not be what you’re after.

Cheers,
Beano


#109

thank you!
My friend and I (he has biss-c with small mige) found that the friction above 0.5 had noticeable notchiness when turning the wheel left to right on a straight.

Haven’t tried inertia at 0.00 but maybe that’s best for larger motors?

Brion, you are insane with the forces…are you wearing a 6-point?


#110

LOL actually the larger motors work better with a little inertia… the smaller ones tend to start to return to center too fast with too much inertia which creates a snappy wheel… BUT with all of these settings the lower the power you use you can actually run less filtering as the filters don’t have to overcome.

It is interesting that you are getting a notchiness with friction the Small Mige I used had a SinCOS, I haven’t yet really got to mess with a BiSS but the resolution is similar to the SinCOS that I use.

The Settings above were for the Small Mige… On my Large I use Recon - 7 D @ 3.25%, F @ 0%, and I @.5% with .593:1 Specific Output 100% w/iRacing at 47Nm

I did find that with the Small Mige that there was a point that too much friction filter would cause it to feel dead and lifeless.

With the higher specific output I like to feel what I used to feel when I actually did some racing so I played with output until I found something that would wear my muscles at about the same amount that I remember feeling after about the same amount of time in a car of a similar type. The big thing with using more power though is that the fine details also come in that much clearer as the amplitude of the force is more real… In real life you let the car do most of the driving and you guide it so once you get your driving style to do that rather than the Sim Style driving where you force the car to do what you want the actual strength output is not as much of an issue and it is extremely satisfying flying through a corner exactly correctly as the flow and feel is light and fast. One thing though is that at higher strength minor set-up changes do become more apparent and a bad handling car will KILL your arms but a good handling car will be a dream… i.e. I ran the Sebring 12hour and I ran a test face for an hour before and I was hurting after an hour… Told my teammates the set-up SUCKED and made some minor changes… Not only did those changes pick up over a second a lap for each of us I also had no issues driving the car for the 2 hour stints we were running, probably could have run 3 hour stints if I wanted… This was with the F488GTE which is a little brutal steering wise.

So in other words the higher strength is really a matter of getting used to it.


#111

Thats interesting indeed about the inertia.
Other than the notchiness, reducing the inertia helped with that snap around center which can be really tricky when you are trying to catch the car and there’s a big delta between the forces from wheel rotated to center and can cause over-correction and snap oversteer.

I installed the DRC file again to ensure everything was as it should be from Tomo, but still the notching.

I will play around with things some more.


#112

Yes if you play with the ratio between damping and inertia you can get an extremely smooth and quick transition over center… My Large Mige settings have that for me at the higher power levels. I don’t remember if I was able to spend a bunch of time on the Small Mige settings on that. That notching is really wierd to me and it seems that more people are reporting things about notching… so I am not sure what the cause might be.

I know going in reverse firmware wise Mika mentioned that going prior to 11 will lose profile settings but It would be an interesting experiment to go back to a 10.x to see if the notching remains.


#113

perhaps Mika might know why ore people are reporting notchiness? something has changed


#114

that is where it is weird… but the hardest thing with something like that is if it doesn’t happen for Mika it will be hard for him to track down if there is an issue within the firmware causing it. this is why the thought of going back to a pre11 release would be something that would have to be done to help figure out if it is something that has been induced recently… I don’t experience it on my Large but I also use a High Res SinCOS and don’t have the BiSS.


#115

Yeah hard to diagnose, especially as exactly nothing related to FFB or FFB processing was changed.


#116

What IONI firmware version are you guys running at?


#117

11.2.
but my friend updated granity to latest version from this site
could that be issue?


#118

Granity is just a tool. IONI firmware is different thing. Please confirm.

And that is the Simucube firmware version, not the IONI firmware version.


#119

I will need t get that info from him tomorrow as he works early and is off to bed.

I am running Simucube 11.2 and IONI drive FW version 10707
I’m running Granity 1.13.0

Thanks


#120

He’s running same Simucube/IONI FW as me


#121

most likely this is not a hardware issue, but an issue with different feel due to another encoder,and maybe the maximum amps the servo is running is different (lower) if your friend used a ready-made drc file. Have him confirm whether or not the displayed current value in Simucube matches what he had before.