Background: My work has often led me to cleaning up confusing/lacking documentation and putting structure around processes.
We need a process to allow new SC owners (like myself) to be able to load up and drive. I’ve spent hours now searching through haphazard posts, year old posts I don’t know are still relevant or not because of all the sim/firmware updates since then, screenshots of FFB settings, randomly shared config files - this is insane.
My Proposal:
For each game, grab up to 3 cars that have known, great force feedback and overall physics fidelity.
For those cars, have users post their best True Drive and in-game FFB settings. Ideally, this would be text/database based rather than pictures but pics will still work.
Those uploads could be upvoted in a way where a consensus emerges.
Put instructions for each sim on how to apply these (as some require custom FFB files).
If the main user keeps tweaking and improving their FFB files? Allow them to version in new settings so that you don’t have to go searching there’s just a single source of truth for users that want to make a name for themselves.
Basically, this stuff needs to be simple. Is FFB subjective? Sure, but this is a cop out. When the devs release 1st party files as templates and then the community immediately all say to start changing things? This is not good enough.
Mika, if this is in the works already then that is absolutely excellent and I really look forward to it! I don’t want to seem ungrateful to you guys as I know you work hard for a dedicated community.
I think new people like myself come into this often from very low end wheels (G27, myself) and I just have this feeling like I’m tweaking settings from 25% good to 50% good. But there is some secret combo I haven’t gotten to that takes it to just a whole other level. Like buying a car and not realizing you have to hit the Sport/Race button to get the full beans.
FFB is a combination of in game and TD settings, heavily influenced by user personal preferences, not TD profile alone.
None of the major wheelbase manufacturers is supplying game specific profiles. There must be a reason for that.
Also there is simplified version of UI if things look too complex and overwhelming at first.
They are really not, once you start understanding the basics. Manual is a good starting point, there was also video circulating explaining different filters.
Good luck, finding settings YOU like is part of the fun.
EDIT: The video I’ve mentioned. It might not be 100% accurate but at least something.
Respectfully, I’ve been down this road already. I do not find the process to be “part of the fun” - the opposite, actually, as I keep tinkering and not getting what I want despite following all user guides, videos, wiki articles, etc.
I know you know your stuff, Andrew. In a system like I’m describing, I would happily look at your best settings and compare them with other well-known posters. Sounds like Mika is saying that sort of thing is coming so I look forward to that and your contributions!
Mate I will have to agree with Andrew on this. I don’t know what Mika and the team are working on, i am sure it is going to be a step in the right direction but still it is not going to cover 100% of everybody. Simply FFB is very subjective and dependent on many things other than the DD motor which will be the only common thing. Previous experience, wheels, buttonboxes, extensions, rigs… all these will affect the FFB feeling. So maybe the best thing you will get is going to be just a good baseline. That works for many people and its ok, but if you are one these guys that want the most out of the investment you made, you will have to understand some basic things in order to be able to feel where the wheel behavior is lacking (according to your personal preference) and then be able to tweak the settings and improve the feeling. There is a learning curve to this and don’t expect that you will master this in 1-2 months. I know it can be frustrating at the beginning (i ve been there too coming from a G29), but once i put the hours in playing and checking the settings, after a while i started realizing what this device can do and how i can get it where i want. I own a SC pro for almost a year and i ve been changing my profiles and settings all the time. The settings i thought were amazing on the 1st month of use feel totally crap to me now and it is normal as with time i am becoming more mature with the use of a DD wheel. Even if i had the best setting from the beginning, i am sure i wouldnt be in position to appreciate them cause i was lacking the experience and couldnt know what this thing could do… So for me, dont expect some magical settings that will solve your problems. Just try the posted settings from other people, see what feels more natural to you (i.e. what reactions you would expect from a real car) and then start tweaking the ingame and TD settings and see where this gets you (trial and error). As you are getting more and more experienced with the SC you will get a better feeling of it and keep improving the settings and sooner or later you will get a grasp of more or less what each setting does and what you should change. One think i can tell you for sure is that after a while the settings will seem simpler and simpler. Definitely the SC can do whatever you want, but first you will have to find out what you want it to do…
OK, but even with this sentence it tells me nothing. What are your lessons learned? Whatever you learned over those months could be handed down to new people saving them months of effort. Did you realize that more/less damper made you feel sidewall more or something? Or that getting rid of the fine tuning altogether made the experience more raw?
I don’t know, I’m making this up. I just went through every single option individually and though some are more obvious than others, I certainly don’t feel like I’ve taken more than a step beyond the default Assetto Corsa ones (which are supposed to be fairly baseline and good).
Those lessons learned are what is lacking. The best video I’ve seen on each setting came from a YouTuber not affiliated with this company.
Hello,
you can find the same exact suggested features proposed by me in past months.
But my idea includes a Online DB where people share settings per game, track, cars with ( rankings = stars or votes/likes )
This way users can download Settings based on rankings by other members and, i’m sure, real pro-drivers.
The features can be integrated into a new true drive tab.
Because everyone learns his own lesson.
In other words over time you start better understand what exactly YOU want from the wheel. Everyone has different preferences. Some may prefer as much micro details as possible, for somebody else that feels completely unnatural and counteracted with extra dampening or high Recon filter.
As @Panschoin said (brilliantly IMO)
I’m not sure why it would be different from any other process/job. Yes, hands on experience is great. But if I have a goal in mind I should have an idea of what to change. I want more slip feelings, kerbs and undulations but not be crazy weighted in the corners and definitely don’t want my hands broken when I crash.
There are multiple ways of achieving that (I hear) but my efforts to achieve it vary by in-game settings and the FFB implementation of each game. So even as I learn, I still don’t know. Hence, boiling down the knowledge of what to achieve and how to achieve it IS the goal. Not the end state, the knowledge of getting there needs to be easier.
I’ve watched many people debate this and people get conflicting answers and results are often not what is desired. If it were so easy, this forum wouldn’t be filled with requests for files and help.
@ezen85 Certainly we are not trying to debate you, we are only trying to help you understand what you should look for. Don’t think of this this as a logical process/job. You may read everything there is about the different filters and settings and maybe you can sort of understand what these may do or not. Most importantly though is to start getting the feel of them and the only way you will do that is by spending hours with it. G27 and SC is day and night. You need to transition from a sluggish, weak and reactive wheel to a proactive, quick, strong and customizable DD wheel. You practically need to change your mind set and muscle memory and for sure it will take some time.
What we could do though to practically help is for you go and check some good posted settings and then let us know what you liked and what you didnt. Explain also your hardware (wheel diameter, if there is a buttonbox, extra spacers) and your driving preference. Drifting for example might need different settings… Then we might be in position to give you some tips/guidelines.
I never really understood people saying FFB is a subjective thing. At least that is not what I am looking for. Ideally I want to feel the same as in real life, and that is not subjective. So, any configuration that helps getting as close to the real thing is right for me. Anything else isn’t, even if it is not to my liking.
I liken it to setting up a car. People drive differently and want different setups to suit their style but there’s still very few specific ways to make the car turn-in better, give more rear end stability or greater top end speed. Those ways have been written down into easy to digest guides and some games like PCARS2 have an engineer within the game that will help you accomplish this if you don’t want to dive in and do it yourself.
This is ideal, in my opinion, for FFB as well. I give you what I want and you help me achieve and test that until it’s where it should be.
I guess teaser images are now a given… but not this week, the thing is not ready for it just at the moment.
Regarding subjectivity:
FFB is our only physical interface to simulated car. Setting up the FFB to be exactly what one would feel on steering wheel in real life is of course most realistic, but then most likely important details can be lost. Therefore some people like to feel oversteer/understeer and road texture that wouldn’t be able to be felt via the steering wheel - in real life those would be seat-of-the-pants feeling and vibrations otherwise.
Therefore, setting up FFB is subjective, there is no way around it.
You are not driving a real car and missing a lot of cues you get in the car. The steering rack communicates small amount of information, when in sim it’s essentially the only mean of physics to communicate. So no, it is not as real as it gets, only a tool to read the physics and immersion booster.
Therefore, setting up FFB is subjective, there is no way around it.
Getting the right feel for a specific user is subjective. But how subjective is it when a person says “I want more wheel weight?” or “I want more understeer effects?” How many ways are there to achieve the goal as stated?
Car setup guides address this something like “decrease front ARB but not below rear ARB”. Simple sentence but encapsulates a lot of knowledge. I don’t need to know why it works to know that it works.
I’ve made my point, though, so I’ll wait and see what comes out from the devs.
