Any Fanatec DD owners moved to SC2?

Simucube 2 Simucube 2 Questions
49

(this is a repost of a post I just did to another thread)
My apologies reg. low force performance at high vs low force setting in TrueDrive.

As some of you know I have posted my findings that it felt to me as if running the SC2 at high force provided a clear benefit at low forces vs running it at low force & using higher gain in the sims.

I have now spent the afternoon trying to reproduce directly, through using DirectInput & sending FFB signal at 200-600hz at various force levels in TrueDrive and in the FFB signal.

The conclusion from this test is that I have been absolutely, completely unable to reproduce this issue going this somewhat more scientifically correct route. Exactly as some other people have told me they did not believe this to be the case. It seems clear they have been right & I have been wrong.

I am not sure what could have caused this difference in some sims when changing forces around & I will try and find the exact root reason of that some other day.

Again, truly sorry about this and for wasting anybody’s time on it.

I will correct my other posts over the next few days to reflect this.

50

That Failatec QR is the worst thing ever produce by them…
And the gold finish…
Failatec Ingeneer: Ok, that is our QR sollution, its like a premium Thrustmaster QR.
Failatec smart guy: But… It is a shitty QR!
Failatec sales guy: mmmm Paint It Gold!!!

51

I have read many of your feedbacks, and refrained from replying, as it seemed you had your own unique requirements wrt ffb.

Now I can say to you this: I have owned and exhaustively tested all main players in the DD wheel market’s products, most notably, 2x Bodnar SS2 54G, 1x Accuforce, 1x Fanatec Podium DD2, 1x SC2 Pro, 1x SC2 Ultimate, many, many different OSW’s, from 20-38NM.

The best wheel on the market today, that can emulate EVERYTHING the others can do, and talking here about useable ffb, not crazy noise, is the SC2 Ultimate, followed closely by the SC2 Pro/Sport. If you do decide to sell your SC2 wheel, doesn’t make any difference to me, but having owned and tested all, you will not find better.

The biggest issue here is not the SC2 wheels, because they are by far the best on the market at this point in time, but rather shortcomings in the ffb delivered by the games, and indeed, limitations in the MS Direct Input itself.

Anyway, whatever you decide, you have many choices, you currently own the best, but of course, feel free to explore, and in the process, waste few thousands of $$’s

Cheers,
Beano

3 Likes
52

Hi Beano,

I have no reason to believe otherwise from a HW perspective. I made a wrong conclusion from a too shallow experience in regards to low force performance which was the only(and wrongly concluded) indication I have had of a weakness.
This not being the case has removed one of the biggest reasons for me to move away.
I don’t agree on many SW and policy priorities of Granite’s as of recent, but will give it more time now to see if filter work might pick up some steam.
Agree 100% the biggest shortcoming holding DD’s back lies in the sims ffb code. Looking forward to that changing over the next several years as well. Wishfully faster!
I really don’t have much time at hand and don’t want to waste neither $ nor time moving away if possible in any way.
Btw not having a good gamma/lfb filter at my disposal for iceracing is now making me spend some time adding such to irffb privately. I do not know if the gamma filter available to Ultimate users would have worked as I need it to, still would have preferred not to have to do this in case it would.

Best,

-Karsten

53

Hi Beano,

As somebody contemplating a new DD, moving from a G29 - what are the ‘real world’ differences between the SC2 Pro & Sport?

Thanks,

54

A few days in with my SC2 Pro over the Podium DD1.

I have to say my very first reaction in game was… holy crap this is smooth - literally just sat in the pits moving the wheel it was very noticeable. Now I’ve done a few hours with it in iRacing I find it much harder to compare now im used to it… I think the differences are there for sure but very slight imo. you would have to have both systems setup and use them side by side to make a really good judgement call.
Honestly just as far as FFB goes I think anyone would be happy with both systems - HOWEVER… ive had issues with the podium in the past (as allot of guys have)… and I live ina remote location so RMA is not an option… or a VERY expensive last resort option. so therefore the switch to SC2 was certainly worth it for me and the main reason I switched.

There are several features on the podium I really miss though im not gonna lie, just because I obviously became accustomed to them more than I realised -
1 - Auto profile switching/game detection - This is now my BIGGEST want… it doesn’t look like you can do this SC2?
2 - Wheel rim rumble feature… I really got used to rumble on red line for some reason… and actually miss this… after a few hours it was no issue obviously… Almost like a bad habit… probably best I no longer have it! lol
3 - Actually the little screen just for live Nm readouts… it make making profile easier as I would aim for a certain max torque on a lap - For example I liked to peak at 12-15nm through Eau Rouge… so the live data was nice - If there a way in truedrive to see the max Nm reached in a session at least?
4 - Dynamic speed sensitive damper filter- This is actually really good at removing oscillations - allowing you to have less damping in low speed.

On the SC 2 side though:
1 - The build quality is on an entirely new level compared to Fanatec - I would argue that the podium looks allot flashier on the rig and SC2 is super simple in comparison. But build quality cant be denied.
2 - Completely love the Ascher racing wheel f28 rim and wireless - unbelievable build quality, and the perfect layout for VR use - I never made use of any of the inside buttons, LED’s or screen on the fanatec v2 - and the fantec felt flimsy in comparison - I have a Cube GT Pro also coming which I expect the same - No stupid $200 hub just to use a custom wheel here
3 - Quick release system is awesome… super simple but solid as a rock - clear improvement - No idea why people would replace the stock SC2 quick release. Total waste of money for no real improvement.
4 - True drive software although far more simple and less features… at least it doesn’t bloody crash on you randomly!
5 - No second driver install package - With Fanatec that was a nightmare and SUPER buggy… and firmware flash was Super easy with SC2 - fanatec need to really sort their shit out here - half the firmware updates they push have a chance of bricking something.
6 - So far… everything JUST works… people say this is a plus on the fanatec side, but was not my experience… at start of every session with fanatec I would often have to switch usb ports or reboot the software to get everything detected and working. so far on SC2… simply turn it on and load iracing, and it all works 100%.

Still loads more testing and play to do until I say im fully upto speed. but for now im very glad I switched. just knowing I have a top class base for a long time to come and never have to worry about it suddenly flaking out on me is enough.

6 Likes
55

I replaced it with a HRS xeroplay qr, I would never go back to standard sc2 qr.

3 Likes
56

Certainly the HRS xeroplay looks fantastic… but the SC2 stock is solid as you can get also (literally zero play)… all your getting rid of is the pin… I guess its upto you if thats worth 200euro to do? I would rather spend cash on other things right now

If it was spending 200 euro to swap the Fanatec Podium QR to the HRS Zero play I would totally understand… and I would be doing it myself for sure - as it actually has a performance benefit

I think ill stick with the SC2 mount tbh. I will only switch between two rims anyway.

3 Likes
57

I replaced it (well, technically added to it because I wanted a longer shaft) with a Q1R and for me, I’m really glad I did, The SC2 QR pin for me was a big pain to remove, and the wheel would often need to be fiddled with to get it to actually deslot. It’s good in a way for that, because it means you do NOT have to worry about the wheel coming loose, but I have some weird arthritis problem in my fingers that made it a lot of trouble. With the Q1R, I can switch between my GT3 and Rally wheels with nearly zero effort, and they still stay firmly attached. Plus I was able to get a longer wheel shaft with that which helped a little bit with placement of things on my rig, but that was secondary and could have been solved in other ways.

The SC2 QR is very good, but for me it was a good choice to add the Q1R on.

58

You probably haven’t used other good quick releases like HRS Xero Play or Buchfink Q1R.
SC2 QR is good but has certain shortcoming comparing to those:

  • Big heavy chunk of metal that gets bolted to wheel, spacer with wheel mount
  • Inability to bolt extension to base, you can only have it on wheel side, unless sandwiching two QRs together (ugly)
  • Pin based lock/unlock making it the slowest “quick” release on the market, plus it gets stuck after some use. Also my personal concern is having sticking part on rotating shaft that can catch on cable or cause some injury.
1 Like
59

Yea I have Q1R releases too actually… but for me personally I haven’t had a need yet to change out the SC2 one.

pull the pin and spin the wheel upside down… tiny tap with the base of your palm on the back of the rim and it pops straight off… new wheel on in seconds. Just as quick as the Q1 for me which you have to be more precise to line up… Its not like im trying to do a 1.9s F1 pit stop when changing my rims anyway… lol

Hardly a big weight… the entire release is only 200g heavier than the Xero Play and the mass is right on the shaft so im sure different rims will make 10x more difference in regard to weight than a QR

But yea, some people completely hate the pin for some reason so that’s fine to change it out if you feel you get value out of it. or maybe its just because of the two rim I use? (Ascher F28 and Cube GT Pro) Other rims there might be a really good reason to change out.

But at the end of the day the default release is perfect fit for purpose, The xero play is an awesome over engineered solution though for sure… and sim racers in general LOVE over engineered gear so it will still sell like hot cakes regardless.

4 Likes
60

Yes, you are correct in everything you wrote, many problems with software, drivers and firmwares.
I was a DD2 user and today I have SC2 Ultimate.
Extremely happy for the exchange, infinitely better.
Fanatec never again !!!

61

There is an extension available actually, see here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkDJMCf_cXA
called “SimCore UH1-55 Simucube 2 Motor Extension”

62

If Granit devices wants to make more money than they already are I would suggest maybe getting some deals with Gaming companies. Or maybe getting geals with racing companies to bring out exclusive gear like wheels and pedals idk. Maybe they already decided against that. A subscription service like Z1 I think is over doing it. It looks like they offer the best wheelbase and software for said wheelbase but I think they need to offer a few more items to keep that money coming in. TD subscription for 1.99 a month isn’t too bad but once we start paying they could just hold off on when they want to release updates for certain things yes? In theory anyway right?

63

Something I don’t understand in this discussion — what makes anyone believe other companies won’t do the same? Or “worse”?

What makes anyone believe VRS won’t go bust next year? or Fanatec decide to stop developing drivers for older units?

GD have already said they aren’t doing it. And even if they did decide to go that route — I’d rather pay a subscription for the next few years to support development than have a very expensive piece of hardware not have any software to run it.

I have no desire to spend another £1250 in a few years time, with an unsellable piece of hardware because there are no drivers.

64

Agree with you here 100%. You simply can not buy any piece of hardware that has infinitive support (be it on HW or SW side) based on the innitial price you paid.
We are moving to a software defined world, and for me that is a good thing. Way more options can be made available on our gear if they can be done in SW and not by swapping HW parts. For sure this development has to be paid though. And for us to take full advantage to all that is possible, we would even want GD to make profit from this. Otherwise, whats the point for them to develop.
I agree that based on innitial pricing, some period of support should be integrated in the base. But I am fully open to a paid model for long term development on my SC2pro, thus securing a long lifespan and excelent investment.

3 Likes
65

I have DD1 and SC2 Pro and I wouldn’t say fanatec is crap.
But not about that
Even though Pro is 25nm at max settings it seems weaker than DD1?

66

Do you activated max tourge mode? That sound odd?

67

Since the 25NM is the max/peak/unsustainable performance, maybe the SC2 pro is set very low to not actually ever hit it?

@Mika?

68

I’m not sure what you are describing.

Simucube 2 Pro can easily sustain 25 Nm for minutes.