The one good thing that has already been proven in courts you might say is that using GPL tools i.e the Arduino bootloader. DOES NOT trigger using GPL code as it is not integrated. As you are generally NOT including that as part of the Base code… It is something already part of the Arduino and not the firmware developed…
But yea when doing an Arduino program if you are using it for anything commercial that you want to protect the code you have to look at the licenses of each and every library you use… MOST are GPL but there are quite a few in the MIT realm which can be used safely. MIT basically allows full use and modification for any reason as long as credit is given to the original developer…
It is just a matter of being careful… But yea there are a lot of things that can be done… I ALMOST fell into the GPL trap before the guy I was working on the iFlag Project with who is a 25 year+ (he retired and then went back, got bored and was asked back) Microsoft senior programmer basically said research this out and REALLY decipher it as we get Weekly meetings about what we can and cannot use due to it being out there. The term he used for it is an infectious or viral license.
If a wheel firmware is updated I receive it, upload it with teensy, that’s all. The source code: why I should ask for something I have absolutely no clue about? If Fe Granite would ask them, and they say no, that doesn’t mean their “no” is based on violation of GPL, but maybe something they don’t want to share, does it.
And the stuff display related is either from VPG themselves or from Sam, which is the official designer of Simagic, beeing contracted to design Nextion templates for Simagic. VPG will soon make some announcements which I think would be impossible if they are working in grey areas. I’m not allowed to say more though, but exciting news.
Obviously I’m not an engineer, and the thread has taking a direction so technical that posts from my side are of no help. And some Groundhog Day similar toxic bores me to the maximum . So I leave this you guys, having so much knowledge and experience
Congrats, super happy for you.
And I will “get over it” when I am good and ready and will see at least a single valid reason to update from Classic version I am using today that incidentally also proven to be the most stable and smooth comparing to all those online releases that broke bunch of stuff in process of adding function I don’t give rat’s ass about.
And if you have a problem with that, well, ask someone who cares.
You just seem to be concerned about others upgrading too, even if they wanted the new direct input filters for example. So do not upgrade, be happy. But maybe you should not bring this up every single occasion you possibly can.
That whole rabbit hole was because you commented about a wheel manufacturer keeping their work private, theirs, and not use OTHER bases proprietary stuff… As well You asked why it was so hard possibly for Granite to make a wheel with a screen…
The Answeres are combined…
#1 - If they (Granite, SimMagic, MOZA, VPG, whoever) use the wrong stuff in their code (firmware), because it would be under an open license their HARD work as you say would NOT be private or proprietary to them anyway and could be requested by anyone to develop their own wheel that would essentially be the same as theirs.
#2 - If Granite does go down that road of possibly NOT using a proprietary interface with SimHUB they could inadvertently open up the ENTIRETY of code that they have proprietarily developed which could include parts NOT actually related to a wheel with screen, This would be dangerous for them if they wish to hold an advantage…
While it is not “HARD” to develop a wheel with a screen, doing it right without the use of a third party developed software is to say the least time consuming…
There was some discussion on Adurino board regarding commercial use.
Seems like with the exception of a few GPL v3 libraries, unless you modify core libraries, no code distribution is required.
That is the HUGE grey area that can bite people… As the GPL License does not differentiate core inclusion from modified inclusion. The Other thing the GPL allows is ANYONE (not just the original creator) to sue that feels that they deserve access to that code and the resultant work… So the best thing to do is stay away from GPL entirely as a creator and a user… The ONLY thing that has been fully exonerated is the bootloader (creation tool) case as that code IS not generally distributed as part of the “firmware” package. However, if it is distributed as a core part of the firmware package then it would trigger the GPL.
In order to NOT distribute a GPL Library in a firmware package that may use it is to actually provide your source code (you can include the un modified library packages) and have the USER compile the Firmware HEX on their machine and then apply it. At that point you are not distributing the library as part of the firmware package.
Granted as you said this is getting into the technical side of Open Source software distribution. 99.9% of the people reading these forums would not have any use for or even really need to know unless they had aspirations of developing an commercial product or software that they wish to protect their developed IP.
I will be honest, the GPL License did help us in one way when rewriting iFlag because since it was released under the GPL it essentially places everything into the public domain and out of the hands of the Original Creator… This allows anyone to make any derivative changes to the program (forking and off line forking) as long as the original creator is credited with the original. We did try for about a year to work with the original Creator in doing the revisions but he was not agreeable to the direction we needed to take with it to make it perform the way we needed it to. What we currently have is now so far removed from the original that it could almost be considered a new program, so we had to do it without official support of the original creator. He has full knowledge of its existence and credit as having developed the original and abiding by the rules it is released under the GPL license.
The thing though is NOW since we have released it as GPL, even if we removed all of the code that was used from the original iFlag (which I think is only about 500 lines out of 70,000 now) and changed the name. We could not take it Proprietary since the code is under the GPL (even though WE developed all that extra code). Granted we knew this going in. We could, however chose to, open up all our code to an MIT License but we cannot close it down further. We actually asked the original iFlag creator to open the code up to MIT so we wouldn’t have to figure out the things we had to do protect proprietary code (which actually is where things ended up deviating significantly from the original).
In our company we also have the rule not to use GPL libraries, if possible.
It is simply too dangerous if you do not provide software that is intended to be open source from the start.
The only thing worse than GPL is AGPL.
Yea generally speaking you probably won’t be sued if you are upfront about what is being used and where… Since of course if you get sued they have to prove as much as you do that things are in there. But seriously why risk it if you don’t have to… The problem is many have no clue as to what these licenses really DO and place their stuff under them because it is what they are told is the thing to do and then people use them not reading or realizing what they ACTUALLY do…
How did I upset you so much? I just tried to say:
A) I don’t think VPG is stealing or using code from 3d party. I can’t imagine Asetek would attach VPG wheels to their DD, and this at an Expo. I think it was in Germany.
And about the code, I just made an example. Mika wrote in postings that "these are information of their software and details which are not shared (no quote).
I apologize for anything that you regard as rude, inappropriate or respectless. I am very close to VPG, and by defending them must have wrote something bad. This was without intention
The firmware, isn’t it something that is not game related, but how the clutch is working, how the wheel interacts with the PC through USB, the rotaries, switches, LEDs, illuminated buttons?
And the different Nextion uploads to the wheel just let me choose which display I want to use? I have a display that I can use with AC, ACC, AMS2, RF2, Iracing, but I need to upload a different template that it works in a game. And, as mentioned, I have Arduino devices off in Simhub, and the Simhub log , to my knowledge, doesn’t mention Arduino
I got it, the Ground Hog… but this was not about you Toxic looks like this…
"You can mechanically connect any wheel to any wheelbase using any 3rd party QR of your choice.
All that rambling for 5 pages just to admit that you don’t care about cableless connection.
This is attention seeking shit posting just to derail the discussion, sorry.
Also what the hell with that authoratitave insulting tone, are you drunk posting all that time or it’s something else?’
Something that is still missing is the ability to see which offline profiles are the ones actually available and active in paddock, I mean a way to highlight those profiles from the ones maybe tried just one time but not saved in paddock
Hi Mika, I remember you mentioned it before, some another major software rewrite coming.
Do you have any timeline for this, would be interesting to see how it differs from what we have today, Classic and Padlock?
first ive heard of it, must have missed it had no idea you were working on all new software but its good to hear, its something to look forward to and i think its good to have that.
